brodie helmet identification

Northamptonshire Regiment who died 14/03/1915 LE TOURET MEMORIAL France ' The Brodie Helmet - WW2 Helmets Vimyridge23 April , 2010 in Uniforms,Cap Badges and Insignia. dailyinfo[22]=' 25368 Quartermaster Serjeant Leonard Henry CADE Meritorious Service Medal 12th Coy. I am not sure if the colour is original, as most pictures shown here are of a lighter green. WW1 BRITISH BRODIE Helmet SOMME relic 60.00 - PicClick UK Brodie Helmet - Etsy Similarly other late entrants into the war such as Portugal relied on supplies of the Brodie to protect the heads of their troops. Why I speak of our Canadian Great war forumyou know, us Canadians? After 1936 a new helmet was produced by McCord Radiator Co, the helmets were stamped with 1 or 2 digit numbers, and 1 letter on the rim, all the helmets have the same paint and texture when in factory condition unlike the modified. 354.85 Buy It Now. Generally soldiers were still being issued cloth caps or leather headgear of a kind which offered little or no protection from modern artillery and the shrapnel which sprayed out from it. dailyinfo[21]=' L/32287 Driver John Frampton GAZE "O" Bty. [1] Contents 1 Background Brodie Steel trench helmet Identification marks Remembered Today: 1081780 Sapper Bedford Stanley LONG "D" Coy. It's definitely a British Mk I helmet. First thing is to see if you can figure out the unit emblem on the helmet. This is due to the split rivet shearing away from strain and the near constant moister of the Western Front. Was wondering if anyone could give some more info on it. View detail. Hello Leon. Yet more often than not the seller has no idea if the helmet is actually of British or American manufacture, and the buyer has no idea either. Known Heat or Manufacturer Lot code Stamp Marks of M1917 shells. I am also unsure whether he began workingin Parliament before or after the war, i will be able to tell you tomorrow though. Few military helmets that have ever been manufactured are as iconic as the Brodie helmet. I find the M1 an excellent helmet when properly adjusted. The helmet istself is a Mk.1* but i have looked and cannot find any manufacturer stamps on either the helmet or liner/strap. External view of a Helmet, Steel, Mark I. RELAWM01013 Internal view of a Helmet, Steel, Mark I. RELAWM01013 The helmet came without the liner and the onlymark in the helmet is 4B and I don't know why but under every scratch looks red maybe the helmet was red. In 1940 a Parliamentary Home Guard unit "The Palace of Westminster Company" was established, consisting of around one hundred Members and staff of both Houses. We live day by day, and I always say: yesterday is history, today's reality, and tomorrow's a dream.' Really appreciate the expertise provided here and hoping that you can help me with the helmet pictured. Thanks for these pictures! UK. -- Henry Flescher, Holocaust Survivor -- March 14, 1924 - August 29, 2018. The shell is an American made M1917A1 made by the ( McCord Radiator Co ) the heat stamp number( 10C ). Kings Royal Rifle Corps who died 02/03/1915 YPRES (MENIN GATE) MEMORIAL Belgium ' NPB. Though we never call it that. Imperial Russian Adrian helmet. 2nd Bn. dailyinfo[6]=' 345190 Sapper Forrest A. KNOWLES Canadian Signal Corps who died 06/03/1921 REIDS MILLS CEMETERY Canada ' With 'COMET ABL 56' printed inside. Most American helmets lack manufacture marks. Upload or insert images from URL. The last issue chin strap was introduced in FM 21-15 by 1972 . i don't know anything about brodie helmet . Sign up for a new account in our community. The bail holder is secured to the helmets skirt by way of a steel split rivet. WW1 US AEF Unit Flashed Brodie Combat Helmet & Liner - $612.65. April 2, 2014 in The military helmets that America copied from other - We Are The Mighty Welcome to the forum, is the red definitely paint? Hi! It does not have that stamp so it is probably one from world war 2 then. dailyinfo[19]=' 9228 Corporal George F. PARRY 2nd Bn. Yet, as well will now see, the Brodies legacy was even greater, for it provided the template for the more influential M1 helmet which was developed in America and which is the most significant military helmet of the twentieth century. Related Weapons & Armor. He was on guard duties mostly on the rooftops of parliament apparently with Churchill quite a lot. The helmet resembles an upside down dishpan or washbasin in that it consists of a bowl-shaped cap and a large uniform brim running around the entire exterior. After many experiments, Brodie came to the conclusion that a relatively simple form of helmet would offer reasonable protection, be serviceable and cheap to produce in large numbers. I found a brodie helmet at an antique shop, its been painted black (going over several peace signs in black sharpie). I've not seen that stamp mark before , it's not WW1, and I don't think it is WW2, it could bepost war. Manufacturing Co - Philadelphia - Pennsylvania. "Foyle." Display as a link instead, stepback_antiques 12 years ago. He worked in WhiteHall prior to the war as a chartered surveyor. dailyinfo[10]=' 14780 Member Ida Styles HUGHES (Oxford) Womens Royal Air Force who died 10/03/1919 OXFORD (ROSE HILL) CEMETERY United Kingdom ' and Gen. Hos. Here is an image ( sorry for bad quality) I have had a good look at your helmet again and managed to find another one to compare,This is an American, Here is a British made helmet from the same period, look at the rim joint how clean the joint is put together, now take a look at the rim joints. Here's one I've have had in my collection for many years is this with the steel rim and second pattern liner, i would say unissued , not sure if it was for the Americans or New Zealand troops, but the main printed label is not easily read .it still maintains the crown label , the white doggy bone looking mark was on there when i got it,maybe a clumsy decorator ? The design was esentially the same in WW2, but there are a number of specific differences between the two and once you recognise these differences, such as the width of the brim (wider in WW1), you find you can tell one from another very easily. http://www.cefresearch.com/phpBB2/index.php, Here is a reply from Roger Lucy, who wrote the book TIN LIDS, "In his article on the Mk.I in Militaria # 6, July, 1994, the British helmet guru, Marcus Cotton, suggests that FKS probably stands for Thos. You need to be a member in order to leave a comment. There are some small differences though, one being British chinstrap have stamped steel or brass slide buckles while the Americans favored cast steel slide buckles. The doughnut was added for the wearers comfort. For instance, we are all familiar with American troops digging up foxholes to serve as make-shift beds and trenches during the Battle of the Bulge in Belgium and eastern France in the winter of 1944. Although the helmet shells do look the same they do not feel the same. I need help identifying some markings on the second world war brodie. M42 winter camo. (hums softly, to the tune of Guantanamera:). 2nd Bn. WW2Helmets.Com observes all Federal, State and local laws. Is it possible to take a better picture of the helmet, are there any markings inside? (Salonika) Territorial Force Nursing Service who died 01/03/1918 KNOWLE (SS. HOW TO IDENTIFY A WW1 BRITISH BRODIE STEEL HELMET FROM A WW2 - YouTube With a liner most HS shells are running around $150.00 on most sites. Also on the remains of the liner there should also be a date/maker name. There is also a very faded 1st division emblem painted on the helmet. used by someone in a fire department role, maybe a works fireman. Follow on Instagram, The British Mark I Brodie & the U.S. P17, know the difference, M42 winter camo. It was owing to its shape that the German forces on the Western Front began to refer to the helmet as the Salatschssel or salad bowl. The Brodie helmet, nicknamed after it's designer, John Brodie, was Britain's answer in 1915 to the disproportionate number of head wounds by troops at the front. Original Canadian WWII Named 1941 MkI Brodie Helmet by General Steel The American M1917 helmet shells were pressed and stamped into bowl shapes by 7 company's they were. Its becoming more popular. I looked around and could not find any listings for that steel maker. My reply to to that collector is below "If the Brodie Red stamp has the words "patent applied" then it's pre pre Aug 1916 , post Aug 1916 stamps were marked "patent no.1 18 03/16". I bought a M1 Vietnam era helmet through mail order surplus years ago and turns out they grabbed me a very collectable M1C paratrooper helmet. Guide Of US Helmets From 1915 To 1983 - WW2 Helmets I think it would be a perfect fit alongside the gas masks in the game, especially with the hype for Battlefield 1 and all. if (year < 1000) year+=1900 SHIPPED TO "MRS. C DeSIMONE" IN MARCUS HOOK PENNA" FROM HER HUSBAND "PFC JOE . It's a little difficult to provide much information from just a picture. shells were re-used by the civil defence services. The M1 became the standard issue helmet for American servicemen during the Second World War following the USs entry into the conflict in the aftermath of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbour in December 1941. Hello Gents, it's been a long time, but I am back with an ID request. The design of the helmet is familiar to anyone who has seen a First World War movie. Click to enlarge the picture 04-08-2013, 01:49 AM#4 homerj109 Re: Help Identifying Brodie Helmet While the basic structure of the M1 remained relatively unchanged in the years that followed, the liner went through many different designs. This is an excellent . I bought aBrodie helmet and I'm not sure from witch war or time the helmet is from. All helmets of this shape and form are known as Brodie helmets - even the ones manufactured abroad. var year=mydate.getYear() I suppose it also is one of the images of the start of WWII for the US with forces in the Pacific wearing it while under Japanese attack at Wake Island and Pearl Harbour. dailyinfo[2]=' 8020 Serjeant Charles POOLE "C" Coy. were refurbished and modified with a new leather liner and web chinstrap. Hi J.H.E. The letter which follows the slash representsthe company who rolled the steel provide for the helmet. Copyright Treasure Bunker Ltd dailyinfo[1]=' Staff Nurse Edith Mary CAMMACK Associate of the Royal Red Cross, 2nd Class 4th Southern Gen. Hos. Colloquially, it was also called the shrapnel helmet or Tommy helmet, and in the United States known as a doughboy helmet. WW1 Brodie Helmet - Fallout 4 Mod Requests - The Nexus Forums A soup dish style helmet from the Great War, offered for sale islabeledincorrectly. The series of number which follow the manufacture mark is a heating lot number used by the factory in the manufacturing process. It was in production already in the summer of 1915 when he was issued with his patent, but it would quickly evolve into a new design in the autumn as some deficiencies in the original were quickly removed and improvements were introduced. Sorry for the long post and thanks for any info you can give me. The most obvious difference may be observed by turning the helmet over. Over the next nearly four years down to the end of the war in August 1945 over 22 million M1s were produced, either for use by America or its allies. I bought it in France and I really don't know what kind of brodie is it and which army used it. It's hard for me to tell without the liner, but could the helmet be American Colin? John Brodie designed the 'tin helmet' as worn in WW1, hence its name. The ring didnt stay gone long and was brought back in 1917 no doubt to the joy of the average Tommy. Steel Helmet, Brodie "War Office" pattern: British Army And this only accounts for its use by the American military. The chinstrap isn't a British one, or at least it's not a wartime example. I think I'll be doing more Vietnam stuff. In August 1915 he acquired a patent for a steel helmet design of his own, one which could be produced from a single sheet of steel pressed into the first basic Brodie helmet. Is it a BEF or US helmet? The helmet was then heat cured creating a hard durable textured finish. var daym=mydate.getDate() I need your help to identify this helmet shell. Help with helmet identification - CMP Forums Although a few American troops did manage to get a hold of covers by in large the A.E.F. The list is on going if you know any more please let us know. The M1 was eventually used in virtually every part of the globe, certainly everywhere that fell within the American sphere of influence during the Cold War, from the Balkans to much of South America and from West Germany to Singapore. A quick examination of an original example and the brush strokes can easily be seen. var dailyinfo= new Array(31) By I always liked the Brodie Helmet, sure as protective as other helmets of the era but a neat helmet. Bluecher German Navy who died 29/01/1915 CANNOCK CHASE GERMAN MILITARY CEMETERY United Kingdom ' dailyinfo[12]=' 457 Lance Corporal Arthur Price ROWE 2nd/7th Bn. The British bail design proved to be too weak for the rigors of the trenches. It was the standard military issue helmet, albeit with some slight alterations to it, for American soldiers in the Korean War and the Vietnam War, as well as a whole host of smaller conflicts and deployments down to the early 1980s. I'm sorry I don't have the answer to your question, but (and I apologise profoundly for what follows) - what's this about another Great War Forum? British helmets were brush painted by hand. dailyinfo[20]=' 10259 Private Charles BUCHANAN 1st Bn. Royal Warwickshire Regiment who died 12/03/1918 ST. A desirable unit marked helmet can go for around $500.00. WWII-Era M1 Helmets: A Beginner's Guide - Military Trader/Vehicles You cannot paste images directly. Royal Horse Artillery who died 21/02/1917 GUARDS CEMETERY, COMBLES France ' Brodie Steel trench helmet Identification marks stands for General Steel Wares of Toronto, who made helmets from 1940 to 1942. This is what so many collectors need to restore an original British WW2 or American WWI Dough Boy helmet to wearable or even presentable condition. Worchester Pressed Steel Co - Worchester - Massachusetts. The final push in using the Brodie was a variant which was produced in 1936 and which saw widespread service by the Norwegians during the German invasion of their country in the spring of 1940 and by the British Expeditionary Force in France several weeks later. Yet there is one piece of military headgear from the twentieth century which was used not just in the Second World War, but also in the Korean War, the Indochina or Vietnam War, the Iran-Iraq War, the Falklands War, the Yugoslav Wars, the First Gulf War and a range of smaller conflicts such as the Cambodian Civil War and several localized clashes in Central America and the Caribbean during the 1970s and the 1980s. Bluecher German Navy who died 29/01/1915 CANNOCK CHASE GERMAN MILITARY CEMETERY United Kingdom ' Me and a mate found. in the late 1930s - 1941 and the M1 helmet and liner was phased in 1941 - 1942. The PASGT helmet was a new generation of combat helmet, being made from nineteen layers of Kevlar, a light-weight synthetic fibre material which offered higher levels of protection than the manganese-steel alloy from which the M1s had been manufactured. if (month<10) month="0"+month Upload or insert images from URL. Capac = Capac Manufacturing Co - Michigan. dailyinfo[9]=' Boy SALEH HAJI S.S. TANGISTAN (Swansea).Indian Merchant Service who died 09/03/1915 BOMBAY 1914-1918 MEMORIAL, MUMBAI India ' By Willow1 3 years ago. whitman75 6 years ago. and Gen. Hos. During the war, the Company took part in fire watching duties, manned a gun at the exit to Westminster Underground Station and undertook a wide variety of training schemes. Progressive Knitting Works - Brooklyn - New York. America ended up purchasing roughly 400,000 Brodie helmets from the British and produced over 2,700,000 M1917 helmets by the war's end. U.S. M2 82nd Airborne Pathfinder Camo. M1 Helmet Identification; Shipping; Sizing; 1-877-862-5245; TOP POTS - DEDICATED TO M-1 HELMET PRESERVATION. The British Mark I chinstrap bails are made from 16 gauge brass or in some cases steel wire. 1-877-862-5245; Home; Contact; About Us; Why Top Pots; Helmets such as this did not leave the factory this way. The high temperature of the oven caused the lead based paint to melt briefly before hardening which encapsulated the saw dust particles securing them to the helmets surface. The main part of the helmet was the steel shell or cap which was produced from non-magnetic Hadfield Steel, a steel and manganese alloy similar to that which the British had begun to employ to make the Brodie helmet as early as 1916. I'm posting them as quick as I can wrap them up, Haven't tweeted in a while. brodie helmet products for sale | eBay That's how the helmet got its official name as well. How the Military Helmet Evolved From a Hazard to a Bullet Shield dailyinfo[19]=' 9228 Corporal George F. PARRY 2nd Bn. Some form of identification may be required if you are unknown to us. Palace of Westminster Home Guard cap badge. If its a split rivet that holds the bails in place, its Brit. The finalised model which went into mass production using Hadfield Steel from late 1915 onwards weighed 2.4 pounds or 1.1. kgs. The chinstrap bails on a British Mark I and a U.S. P17 are of a completely different design. Vimy Ridge?, First to adopt Motor machine guns, feared by the Germans for our Shok troop tacktics..HEE HEE HEE, just picking on you. 4th Bn. 25.00 1 bid 5.35 postage 5d 19h Click & Collect Repro British Army WW2 Plastic Helmet Tommy Doughboy Brodie Style WWII Soldier 12.99 Click & Collect Free postage The helmets I have seen wereUSM1 helmets, however they might have worn the Brodie pattern too earlier on. Regards, Paul. dailyinfo[24]=' Captain Denzil Robert THURSTON Air Force Cross Airship Training Wing (Cranwell). By the by, not all MKIIs are British or even issued to troops. The shape of the shell tells me its WWI manufacter. Seaforth Highlanders who died 20/03/1919 BEIRUT WAR CEMETERY Lebanese Republic ' Thus, over a quarter of a century it had seen widespread service from the trenches of northern France in 1915 to the flight from that same region twenty-five years later, an action which ensured that Britain could continue the fight against Nazi Germany. dailyinfo[18]=' 6422 Private Charlie GILBERT 4th Coy. A British Brodie 'Tommy' steel helmet with net and leather lining. WWII US M-1 101st AIRBORNE 506st PIR HELMET ALL ORIGINAL. While the M1917 and Brodie helmets appear very similar, a few characteristics like the chinstrap ball, construction material and paint were slightly different. Twenty years of peace followed the end of the First World War before another major international conflict broke out. It wasundoubtedly a welcomerelief from having the helmet constantly bounce up and down on the top of the wearer skull while running across no mans land. 5min video no sound date 1918 Military helmets manufactured at a factory in USA. View detail. Reproduction WW2 British Army Brodie Helmet with Chinstrap - Tommy Failing this, simply search on this forum under Brodie and you should find a wealth of information etc. dailyinfo[3]=' 45 Gunner HAZURA SINGH 31st Mountain Battery Indian Mountain Artillery who died 03/03/1920 TEHRAN MEMORIAL Iranm ' A thick felt pad was fitted to the top of the skull interior to aid in cushioning against impact. The helmet was basically an inverted bowl stamped out of a single piece of manganese alloy, which was made up of 13 percent manganese and was .036" thick. Im thinking about making a visit to the Imperial War Museum in London to show one of their specialists as it seems to be hard to find information about it. i read threads forum about brodie he Stahlhelm, the stages of the helmet-making process of Stahlhelms for Remembered Today: http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675048436_military-helmets_assembling-helmets_dipping-into-paint-tanks_wooden-crates. F Thomas Firth and Sons Sheffield 1916 1918, FS Thomas Firth and Sons, Sheffield sept. 1915 1919, HS Hadfields Ltd. jan. Sheffield 1916 1919, BS W Beardmore & Co. Ltd. jan. 1916 1919, A Edgar Allen and Co.Sheffield Ltd 1916 1918, HH Harrison Bros. & Howson Ltd. dec. 1915. Both were manufactured using a similar process. Lincolnshire Regiment who died 05/03/1916 CITE BONJEAN MILITARY CEMETERY, ARMENTIERES France ' "We Cannot Always Buy What We Want, But We Buy What We Can". The original and very distinctive steel helmet adopted by Great Britain was designed and patented in 1915 by its inventor, John L Brodie. dailyinfo[28]=' 19673 Leading Aircraftman Samuel Ambrose TICKNER Meritorious Service Medal No. The British helmet is made from 21 gauge steel, while the American helmet is made from 19 gauge steel. Please consider supporting our videos on Patreonhttps://www.patreon.com/simplehistoryThe British Helmet in World War IJohn L. Brodie had invented and patente. and 34th Coy. Missing the chinstrap and liner. These have some 115716872255 WW2 ARP & Civil Defence Helmets & Markings Eventually all his knowledge will be distilled in a book. Helmets were procured from British supply until such point as the Americans could supply themselves with their own helmets. Here is an image ( sorry for bad quality) There are 3 letters painted on the front i think it could be either one of these combinations: Yet its use did not stop there. Classic cars Its service history within the US armed forces spans a period of over forty years, being the standard issue military headgear for American soldiers between 1941 and 1983 and inspiring imitation models around the world. The American manufactures used an entirely different method to apply the paint to the helmets. So a large number of Americandough boyswore British made helmets though out their service in France. Commonly referred to as the "Kelly" between 1932 and 1936 the M1917 and the British MK1 helmets in America. By holding a British shell in one hand and an American shell in the other the weight difference is obvious. dailyinfo[20]=' 10259 Private Charles BUCHANAN 1st Bn. What to Look for When Buying a WWII M1 Helmet (Beginner's Guide) So. M16 LW transitional helmet. Fully restored with river gravel finis New Zealand Engineers who died 13/03/1918 ST. POL COMMUNAL CEMETERY EXTENSION France ' New user here. The British did have an upgrade that was never adopted by the Americans. lol. He worked in Eastgate House, Exter. British Nurse Vera Brittain, http://warrelics.eu/forum/helmets/ww1-b met-16128/. It is unknown what is any maker marks these companies used. This was the American M1 helmet, arguably the most iconic and recognizable military helmet produced in modern times. With New Vegas, I luckily was able to use the NCR Trooper Helmet, but there is no helmet like that in this game. The Brodie helmet is a steel combat helmet designed and patented in London in 1915 by Latvian inventor John Leopold Brodie (Latvian: Leopolds Janno Braude).A modified form of it became the Helmet, Steel, Mark I in Britain and the M1917 Helmet in the US. The helmet was rimless and was painted a smooth dark-green color. Sign up for a new account in our community. Should I get a replacement liner and chinstrap or just leave it as it is? You can post now and register later. While they were initially produced from manufactured paper fibres, these models were quickly discontinued when it was realised that they degraded in short order, particularly in the tropical conditions of the Pacific War in 1942 and 1943. Yes would be very interested to see the other documents, menu and any other informationyou have as these might help with identifying the letters on the helmet. dailyinfo[12]=' 457 Lance Corporal Arthur Price ROWE 2nd/7th Bn. var mydate=new Date() Unlike the ubiquitous Stahlhelm which had been developed by the Germans around the same time the Brodie did not have a nape piece extending further down at the back to protect the neck, however, it did offer greater all round protection from shrapnel descending down into the trenches. Frank Harrison EDINGER Army Chaplains Department who died 26/02/1918 HOLLYBROOK MEMORIAL, SOUTHAMPTON United Kingdom ' World War One Warfare & The Revival of the Helmet - warhistoryonline These will comfortably fit a head size 57-58 cm, or a tight 59. Royal Horse Artillery who died 21/02/1917 GUARDS CEMETERY, COMBLES France ' Consequently the Infantry Board resumed its experiments to produce a new design.